New Defenders to be built but not from where you'd expect.

[Trevor]

As to my earlier statement about it's what the people will actually do in the new Defender that will make the difference........
If LR's current pricing strategy is anything to go by, looks like all most folks will be doing at first is making payments!

I struggle with that position simply because I don't think it's about the end user at all making a brand. That is the role of the company itself. They decide what they want to be, what they want people to do with their widget, and they then build on that to further the brand.

LR at one time got that....they REALLY got that. It was what made them quite unique in the automobile space. They really were the company that forced the "lifestyle" concept long before anyone knew that was a thing.

Therein lay the rub. The last 10 years have seen a complete abandonment of those core principles and a complete reshaping of the company into a luxury only, mall crawling brand. Sure, they still try to leverage their past for a "coolness" factor, and why wouldn't they. That's just smart marketing.

In the end they still have to make something that represents that off-roading work-a-day market if they want to have any credibility in the space....basically they need to go back to their roots and build a Jeep Wrangler. And they make nothing of that sort now, or even anything remotely close.

The fact of the matter is no matter how hard one tries, the end user can never make LR what it does not want to be, and they most certainly do not want to be what they once were.

[ugly_90]

I saw my first new Quigley Ford Transit 4x4 van here at a jobsite. Big tires, ample space inside for camping, can sleep several. Diesel engine maybe?? Times, they are changing..

[Matt H]

I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens if it ever arrives?
I think the 'Defender' nameplate has too strong a following to be entirely abandoned by enthusiasts overnight. Folks build up first generation Freelanders for crying out loud.
Will it be the same as before? Likely not, but I don't think everyone will immediately turn their back on the model either. After all it took twenty years and four generations for JLR to totally ruin the Discovery! Even longer for the Range Rover!!

Personally I don't think any new vehicle from any manufacture (including Jeep) is really any better today than it was twenty years ago. Certainly not for the amount of money they charge for one.

My 2c.

[Trevor]

Personally I don't think any new vehicle from any manufacture (including Jeep) is really any better today than it was twenty years ago. Certainly not for the amount of money they charge for one.

My 2c.

It's about what they build out of the box, and then what you can customize after the fact imo. That's where Jeeps still excel. Out of the box a Rubicon eats all comers lunch. Indeed, there is a cost to it and it does seem high at 60k, but that's more a result of the broad devaluation of currencies generally. Today's 60k is yesterday's 30k. You get less by spending more, and this trend will continue until our fiat currencies collapse entirely. It's always been that way, and always will be that way. That's just a function of printed money by fiat. It's the relative values that are important for our purposes (what does a LR Discovery cost relative to one of its direct competitors?)

That all having been said, when you can easily customize a rig, that's when the 4x4/overlanding/lifestyle market really opens up I think. Again, Jeep saw this in spades with the Rubicon, and several of their 4x4 "light" models, and made the right after-market partnerships to give their customers ample crack to feed their habits. Tata could have done the same thing with the Defender because you had an iconic 4 x 4 that was infinitely tweakable. But of course they though the more prudent move was to cancel the concept entirely.

I think the only bright spot in this dark tunnel that LR has gone down is the faint hope that the brand does get sold, and it is bought by someone/something which has a clue. Tata doesn't. The only hope for LR becoming LR again is that there is a next owner, and that they actually understand the brand. A real long shot obviously.

[Matt H]

I don't disagree, the point I was driving at was I'd rather buy a twenty year old TJ Wrangler than a new JL or Series 1 Discovery than a New Discovery 5. Not all advances are progress.

I'm not sure what LR will do to support or not support a New Defender. But I believe folks will still try to build them up. How many or for how long is the question?

Look at the FJ cruiser.  Despite being crap in every way and ultimately failing as a model line, initially lots of Toyota guys still tried to build them up because of the halo of the classic FJ's of the past.

I'm thinking the same will happen with the Defender. How long that honeymoon lasts depends on the afore mentioned "tweekability" of the new unit.

Of course I could be totally wrong and the new Defender will be as shit as we all fear and nobody will buy it, build it or even want it! Ho knows??

[Trevor]

That's a really good point Matt. There may be some support for it from the die-hards. As you rightly note though, it'll all depend how far down (or not) the shit scale it ultimately is. When it's all said and done, there's no point trying to teach a pig to sing; it's a waste of your time and it just annoys the pig.

[Red90]

https://www.cnn.com/videos/cars/2018/11/28/jeep-gladiator-unveiled.cnn/video/playlists/business-drive-cars/

[headdamage]

Well that screws things up.... I want the Jeep and none of the available offerings from rover, this and Trump force me to conclude the end times are upon us.

[binch]

Love the Name....reminds me of the scene from Monty Python's life of Brian where Ceasar is telling off a guard:    "With wotten behaviour wike that you wiww soon find yoursewf in gwadiatior schoow!!!

[Trevor]

Well that screws things up.... I want the Jeep and none of the available offerings from rover, this and Trump force me to conclude the end times are upon us.

Yeah, that's a pretty decent looking rig. A lot like a Defender pickup of old but roomier, more stable, and more comfortable.

...and don't worry about the end of times, Trump will save you...He's like a Super-Prez, striking down libtards with a single blow ;->

[Red90]

New spy shots of the 110.

https://www.motor1.com/news/286490/land-rover-defender-spied-new-body/
You cannot view this attachment.

[Trevor]

hmm, that doesn't look much different than some of their current offerings.

[Red90]

A D5 with a D4 body.  The ground clearance is horrible looking at the side shots.  Has anyone looked at how the D5 has coolers directly in front of both front wheels?  :o

[Trevor]

It certainly represents nothing "Defenderish"....like nothing whatsoever.

[headdamage]

The cheap rubber bonnet hold downs (part of the camo I think) look to be the most sensible parts on it. The front side windows do look slightly roverish in their shape.