rebuild? 97 Disco in Yellowknife

Started by Ron T, April 06, 2022, 11:32 PM

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Ron T

we made it through the winter, until this morning.  Backing into my spot at work the temp gauge topped out.  The gasket on the water pump apparently failed, and its clear that a cylinder head gasket has too and/or the head is warped.  It was time to replace it, until a friend suggested fixing it and the idea came to mind to look into replacing the failed engine with a chev engine.

It needs a windshield, some serious body work, and more.  The friend who suggested rebuilding it has a car that I can use indefinitely, which was holding me back from putting my only grocery getter in the shop for an extended stay.

In the end, whether it's this Disco 1 rebuilt, or its used for parts for another Disco 1, who would do the work?  There isn't anyone locally in Yellowknife or the NWT that I know of with the experience, tooling, and shop space to do this.

Thanks for being there, helping to keep another LR safely, and looking good, on the road.

   Ron Thompson, Yellowknife

Red90

It already has a Chevy engine... Lots of money would be involved to change to a different one if paying someone to do it. It is a big job. A typical LS swap from a shop is $30k.

You could grab a used engine from a wrecked LR and put it in.  A couple grand at least and you are no farther ahead.

Craig B

I have a bunch of body panels if there is a problem with them.


Craig

Trevor

#3
Bert at Sportscar Centre in Edmonton is the only shop I would recommend. That said, I know he is extremely busy with projects right now too.

I looked into a LS swap for my D2 several years ago. It's not at all worth the cost and headache. John's numbers are correct, you'll be all of 30k.

If you want rebuilt new, Turner is a good choice out of the UK. But expect to be paying between 15k - 20k by the time it is installed (assuming you have a shop do it).

Rebuild the existing is an option. I can't offer any insight on cost there but Bert would be able to give you an idea.

A wrecker motor is an option, but do you want to spend 5k+ (again, assuming you have a shop do the swap) for what is basically a crapshoot?

Unless you're really attached to the vehicle, it may be better just putting it out to stud.

"You will be hollow. We shall squeeze you empty, and then we shall fill you with ourselves."
― George Orwell, 1984

Freedom Convoy Truckers -- Canadian Heroes!
Justin Trudeau --Enemy of the People!

Ron T

Thanks everyone,

    its not a matter of attachment, more likely I'm mad :-)  OK, locally its $26K for a low mileage 2015 Terrain with a 2.4 L engine, from the local GM dealer.  So I have something newer, with an engine that locals tell me won't take our winters either.  Lots of things I wouldn't use, but it might have resale value.  I really appreciate how well the Disco handles and how much I've enjoyed it when I'm driving something else.

    What I'd get for $26K is a compromise compared to what I may have with $30K invested in a vehicle that I do have confidence in (handling, on our roads both seasons, winter and bug season).

    If it could be booked in to a reputable shop that would either re-build it, or make a good one out of parts from others, I'd talk to them.  There are some modifications I'd like while I'm at it.  And i'd like to go over some systems to reduce electronic noise so that I could operate my amateur radio gear while on the road.

    Should it last another ten years that would seem about right for me personally, maybe I shouldn't be behind the wheel on public roads in my mid-70's.  The Disco and I could retire at the same time.

     The group here is a great asset, thanks.  I haven't paid my due since a bank cheque I sent a few years ago didn't get cashed, the bank sends me a notice every few years to remind me that its still out there somewhere.  If I can pay online I'll do that, I owe the group at least that.

    Ron T

binch

Don't worry about the dues this year......We are just coming out of the fun times so enjoy it while you can.   Come january 2023 we'll be collecting the dues again.

cheers, Bill
Cheers, Bill

Ron T

Thanks!  I do understand that there are costs involved in keeping the website and more going.

Red90

Based on that, I would bring in a rebuilt long block from a reputable supplier and get it installed locally.  There must be someone that swings a wrench that can be trusted?  It is a very basic job and no different to any other per 90's vehicle.  You really want the local support on the install in case any issue pops up.

https://www.turnerengineering.co.uk/rover-40-46-v8-petrol-engine-parts-c102x3005626

But, keep in mind that in the end the rest of the vehicle is 25 years old and anything else could reach the end of its life.

Conversions to modern engines sound appealing but they almost always have years of teething problems and reliability issues.  It is only a path to follow if you really want a lot more power.

On the radio question, you probably need to find a local radio geek to pop around with a radio that has a spectrum analyzer and see what is causing the issue.  Normally, regular ignition suppression with a capacitor and possibly power supply filtering should be fine for a mobile radio.

Trevor

#8
One thing to remember about conversions is that you will be dealing with a setup that is not LR, and is not Chev. You end up with a bit of a hybrid mix of components to make it all work, and the ECU's are re-programmed hybrids as well. For some folks that's no problem. Something to be aware of in any case.

If you go with something like a new Turner rebuild then you are still dealing with all standard LR components. That does simplify support down the road. Same would apply if you had the engine rebuilt locally.   

Also worth noting, if you need basic replacement parts (alternators, starters, water pumps, etc) for D1's or D2's, check Rock Auto. For any given component you will have a selection ranging from Chinese crap all the way to OEM brand name, and all points in between. Their prices are far cheaper (including shipping)  than you can get here, or shipped from the UK. And i usually have the component in 2 - 3 days. Since the D1's and D2's are running old rebranded GM motors, most parts are readily available from RA. Good place to keep in mind if you start this project, it will save you some $$'s.
"You will be hollow. We shall squeeze you empty, and then we shall fill you with ourselves."
― George Orwell, 1984

Freedom Convoy Truckers -- Canadian Heroes!
Justin Trudeau --Enemy of the People!

Ron T

Thanks for the advice and suggestions, I'm taking it all in.  WRT to cheap parts, i had some interesting experiences with low end starters, and I've gotten pretty good at replacing it.. Wore the brushes out on my starter in early winter, replaced it with a cheap new one, which worked fine when inside and warm, but would not engage the Bendix when outside and cold.  Bought another one, slightly different style from a different vendor, and had the exact same problem. Removed, inspected, checked lubrication and function, re-installed multiple times but no improvement.  Couldn't figure out why the Bendix wouldn't engage when cold, even tried lighter lubricants on the Bendix drive. Then I discovered that repeated cycling (I'd already replaced the starter relay, no improvement) of the starter would eventually get it to work.   The colder the temperature the more cycling of the ignition switch was required.  Over time I found that it was not the number of times that I cycled the ignition starter switch, but how long I held it in the start position.  The conclusion was that the extended "on time" of the starter solenoid was warming the Bendix mechanism.  In the end I'd hold the key in the start position for 30 seconds or so, depending on how cold it was, leave it for two or three minutes while the heat got into the Bendix, come back and it would turn over immediately on the next attempt.  After a couple of weeks of starting it that way the new cheap starter worked flawlessly no matter how cold the engine was.

   Back to the engine problem, the last engine, which had been installed about eleven years ago, was a salvaged one from a 96 with low mileage..  They do not, I'm blaming the aluminum heads, like the colder winter temperatures we see too frequently here and over time gaskets give out.  I'd like another ten years, it might be less if getting affordable fuel is an issue :-)  Does rebuilding the engine help with the failing gasket problem?

   Using my D1 for parts (has a stainless exhaust and more) in rebuilding another low mileage D1 is another idea.  The replacement D1 could be built up for me down south and I'd only ship parts to whoever is doing the work.  Or find another roadworthy low mileage D1 and drive it up here, remove parts from mine to keep as spares.

    Differences from the last time I started down this path, its easier to travel now (wrt COVID restrictions), and I have a longer term loaner vehicle to use.

    Regarding the amateur radio installation, I'm NOT looking at doing this (maybe you've seen this picture before)
https://retrovoltage.com/2012/08/16/awesome-vhf-rover/
Something much less with only a couple of antenna, HF and VHF/UHF

     Ron T. (VE8RT) 

Matt H

Why not just get a new water pump, a pair of reconditioned heads, decent quality gaskets and some head studs and just repair the current engine?
No Road Except For Land-Rover.

Ron T

Well we want it, or it's close replacement, to be a nice vehicle again.  There are rust problems, broken windshield, damaged interior panels, and more.  There are also many parts that had been replaced and should be good for years yet.  Some of those parts and the spares I have may be hard to find now.  Figure into all this mess that finding a skilled and reliable mechanic here in Yellowknife has long been a problem.  I've had mechanics I was happy to take my vehicle to, after a few years they up and left.

We're heading out for a while, overnighting in YYC on the way out, and again on the way back. 

Winter has been so long, and I'm coming home worn out after work, it is very hard to see a path forwards.  We know what we'd like, but from up here its not clear how we can get there.

Matt H

#12
In that case  you will be dollars ahead to just replace it. Your going to have to travel and your going to need to spend around $8,000 to $12,000 for a nice, rust free example as they are getting harder to find these days. More if you want "options".

I'd build one for you, and I do have a couple of Discovery 1's in progress but until I retire from my day job I can't commit to a timeline. Besides I'm about as far away as a person can get from Yellowknife and still be in Alberta lol.

I'll keep my eye out for you.
No Road Except For Land-Rover.

Ron T

That sounds like an offer hard to refuse :-) Seriously.  I've been offered a grocery getter and can wait, we were figuring that this may take  more than a few months.  We're gathering things together to go on a trip out east, Saint Pierre et Miquelon as I worked there almost ten years I have pensions to get started, then on to Newfoundland.

Saturday evening we arrive in Calgary, do our COVID testing at the airport so we can get into Saint Pierre (France, overseas territory), then get as much rest as possible as we're off to Halifax around 11 pm.  On the return we're again overnighting in YYC before flying to Yellowknife.

Please keep in touch, the gmail account that I have on my mobile phone is ars.ve8rt@gmail.com

If I don't reply promptly I may be busy, or while in Saint Pierre to keep international phone rates down I may have my phone off.  The B&B should have Wi-Fi when we're not out catching up with friends.

   Thanks,   Ron

Matt H

It would probably be best if I just go ahead and build it and when it's ready if you're still in the market for a decent Discovery 1 you can come take a look.

I usually turn around one or two Land Rovers a year. I still work full time and have started small scale farming so timelines are getting stretched. Sometimes I drive them for a while before moving them on. Sometimes my kids snag them. Every now and then I fall in love with one and I end up hanging onto it a little longer but eventually they all get fixed up and sold on.
No Road Except For Land-Rover.