Radio Communications on trails

B-Red · February 11, 2017, 10:22 AM

As we are getting closer to spring, it's good to open a thread regarding radio communications.
Cell phones have a great reliability in accessing other people for meetings however it may become impractical and unreliable to direct on the trail.

Comes along CB radios where communications up to three km line of site can be ok and short ranges.

Walkie-Talkie handhelds are another short range communication tool.

HAM radio equipment varie based on HF, UHF and VHF Bands used. You are required to have a license. Antennas also become different in size and shape. Old military radios may fall under some of these ham ranges. Need to check carefully. Plus you need a license.

Then comes along the Commercial Radios and their LAN channels. Logging trucks use them. They are required on such trails to track locations against the markers. LAN channels access repeater towers and are for public use. More popular than CBs on this side of the west. More chatter along the road.

So, which one are you going to have in your Off Roader this Spring???

Emad

ugly_90 · February 11, 2017, 10:54 AM

I'm abstaining from this thread :-X :-X

binch · February 11, 2017, 11:10 AM

My CB is simple and inexpensive, and allows for coms within a group. That's all I need thanks. There are many different types of bells and whistles to get but I enjoy the simplicity of a CB........ and the danger of my 8' long antenna ;D

For longer range emergency coms I carry a SPOT satellite beacon (which is available for club trips by the way....just have to ask). This allows me to give location updates to contacts in civilization, send a call for assistance in a breakdown or other NON-emergency situation, and last but certainly not least....it has a SOS or 911 mode that will activate and emergency medical response where ever I am. The 24-7-365 monitoring people will contact local emergency service proximal to where the distress can originates. That could be Parks Canada, RCMP, Provincial police, Coast Guard, etc.

That covers my bases pretty well..... ;)

B-Red · February 11, 2017, 12:59 PM

It is mandatory to have a commercial radio in order to drive on some of the logging trails between Alberta and BC. Each vehicle in the group is required to have one. Some of the Radio puffs can for sure comment here on this.

The HAM license study material is on line based plus hard copy study books. NARC in Edmonton administers the exam. So does Industry CANADA.

Aside from calling for emergencies, long range communications could be fun to connect with off roasting groups on the trails outside Alberta. Could become quite fun.

Trevor · February 11, 2017, 01:16 PM

I know several folks that run VHF licensed radios, along with their CB's. They are nice for range, but the issue is you need everyone on the trail to have one because you never know who is going to get misplaced, fall behind, etc.

I like the idea of CB's as the primary coms, good trail lead/follow protocols (never lose sight of the person behind you), and then a SPOT system like Bill has for the club. That way if you get into real trouble you do have an assured way of communicating for help that doesn't require special licensing.

My 2-bits anywhoo.

B-Red · February 12, 2017, 11:06 AM

Satellite tracking and emergency notification has advanced significantly. You have three that I now know off:
SPOT is an old proven method that worked well on the trips that we did.
INReach is another platform that is available around with more txt features and various packages.
Iridium is a new one to me. Thank you Adam for pointing this one out. I checked their web site and they do have few unique features and products. Their satellite network is more comprehensive and better rated for northern areas than the others. They have your tracker products. However, they do have a new products that combines the existing IPhone or Androide that we have to become global communicators as voice and SMS, Tracking and Emergency notification.

Do your research if you are going to buy a unit. Technology is advancing significantly in this field; that is if you want to be found ;D

Emad

Trevor · February 12, 2017, 11:20 AM

Quote from: B-Red on February 12, 2017, 11:06 AM
that is if you want to be found ;D

Emad

Good point ;D

ugly_90 · February 12, 2017, 01:58 PM

I swore off comments on this thread just like Amy Winehouse swore off drinking.. no rehab here either.

On the radio comms, there's many directions to go, depending on skill and budget. For portable satellite voice or location, I do know of one large company that won't use Globalstar satphone, or Globalstar SPOT for northern Alberta and BC.

Globalstar uses geostationary satellites 35,000km above the equator. Iridium uses much lower polar orbital satellites, the last of the new constellation of Iridium NEXT are still being launched.

Iridium's competitor to the SPOT is the InReach. North of the Alberta border into NWT, and in some parts of Northern BC, Globalstar can be spotty. Some years ago, Globalstar wouldn't work into the arctic at all. I don't know if this is still the case.

Globalstar is great for the lower 48 or the southern half of Alberta/BC.

I note both Globalstar and Iridium had been close to bankrupt at least once, so you are hitching a ride on their star.

The wider subject of communications is as wide as you want to take it.

SpeedyJ · February 12, 2017, 02:25 PM

If used responsibly the Baofeng handhelds are awesome for their value and flexibility. They offer the ability to run VHF, UHF, Family band etc. Punch in a frequency and go....

Of course this ease of use is what makes them illegal here in Canada. I have a few that I use on licensed VHF commercial channels, I frequently work on different crews with different companies, so the ability to program on the fly is incredibly useful. I frequently reach past my $850 Motorola XPR radio to grab my Baofeng simply because it's so much easier to use. The UHF band is useful to scan for free channels or troubleshooting radio modems for data usage. It's one of the most used diagnostic tools in my tool box.

If you're into bending the rules a little you can run a little more power on the family band channels in remote areas, just don't do it at the ski hill or you'll walk all over everybody.

They run $35-$55and accessories run $5-15 (car chargers, mics, etc...). You'll need to source them outside of Canada, my first set came from Amazon.com with US delivery (they won't ship to Canada), the second set came from Aliexpress, their vendors will ship anywhere.

The danger is that if you don't know what you're doing you can interfere with all kinds of other operations - law enforcement, fire, aircraft, etc.... So you have to know what you're doing. The Baofengs are not locked out, so they're not idiot proof.

The HAM course is a good idea, radio folks take this stuff very seriously, if you mess up they will call you out for it.

I'm just coming to the end of a month long tour in Alaska to implement GPS enabled radio crew tracking in a remote area, this is a topic I've spent some time considering.

ugly_90 · February 12, 2017, 04:52 PM

Again, this topic is fairly bottomless.

The Baofeng and other counterfeit chinese radios are a poor choice technically, as under testing, they fail to meet specifications of most branded equipment, are poorly constructed, cheap and illegal. Fines for infraction with radio equipment would meet or exceed the value of the landrover. That would be a bad day.

The Baofengs lack an IC certification number for use in Canada, or an FCC number showing any American certification either. The XPR isn't that great a conventional radio either, as it was developed for use on digital systems, and is a digital radio that happens to do analog mode. There are better choices.

Handhelds are also not permitted for use on haul roads either, it usually must be a mobile radio.

There's lots of ways for members to go wrong on this. It's much simpler to plan your communications than doing a one-off. If one were planning a club outing, it may be possible to ask nicely to " Gardenome ", and have access to rented satphone or VHF/UHF radio equipment at little or no cost to the club.

Many of the legal and technical hurdles would be overcome, although it would be very expensive if any gear were lost or damaged.

Matt H · February 12, 2017, 05:29 PM

CB for me. Cheap, accessible & easy. Obviously has it's limits but then again sooner or later you need to embrace the notion that if you go into remote areas you had better be prepared to get yourself out if it all goes sideways. Being aware of the risks and being prepared is important. Back country travel is hazardous.

Even with the best communications a rescue could be many hours, or even days, away. Never a good idea to rely on technology to get you out of a jam. Simple ETA's, instructions, route info and notifications left with those living in civilization can also be really effective.

This isn't bravado. It's reality. The latest Communication tech is defiantly a huge advantage and I'd be the fist to take advantage of such in an emergency situation. But it's not a absolute necessity. Mandating such could/would put a lot of folks off joining in on club trail rides.

My 2c

Trevor · February 12, 2017, 09:11 PM

Quote from: Matt H on February 12, 2017, 05:29 PM
CB for me. Cheap, accessible & easy. Obviously has it's limits but then again sooner or later you need to embrace the notion that if you go into remote areas you had better be prepared to get yourself out if it all goes sideways. Being aware of the risks and being prepared is important. Back country travel is hazardous.

Even with the best communications a rescue could be many hours, or even days, away. Never a good idea to rely on technology to get you out of a jam. Simple ETA's, instructions, route info and notifications left with those living in civilization can also be really effective.

This isn't bravado. It's reality. The latest Communication tech is defiantly a huge advantage and I'd be the fist to take advantage of such in an emergency situation. But it's not a absolute necessity. Mandating such could/would put a lot of folks off joining in on club trail rides.

My 2c

Agree fully. The best approach is always to be able to stay out much longer than you planned.

B-Red · February 12, 2017, 10:03 PM

Quote from: Matt H on February 12, 2017, 05:29 PM
Even with the best communications a rescue could be many hours, or even days, away. Never a good idea to rely on technology to get you out of a jam. Simple ETA's, instructions, route info and notifications left with those living in civilization can also be really effective.

Actually Matt, I was more interested in Pizza Delivery for my late night snack. Reliable communication will get me that Pizza even if they have to use Amazon drones. ::)

Gardenome · February 14, 2017, 06:18 AM

We do have some vhf road radios on sale right now. Former rental units. Motorola CDM1250's if you want to look up some specs.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

B-Red · February 14, 2017, 06:44 AM

Quote from: Gardenome on February 14, 2017, 06:18 AM
We do have some vhf road radios on sale right now. Former rental units. Motorola CDM1250's if you want to look up some specs.

Are these programmable for LAN channels and various industrial sites? I am assuming you also need industry Canada annual License ( around $40-$60 roughly). How about the Antenna? What's the price range?