Alberta Land Rover Enthusiasts Club Forum
General => Technical Discussions => Topic started by: Bargrip on May 18, 2018, 01:00 PM
Was toying with the idea of going with 285-75-16 tires...
Going on a 90 200tdi with a 1.4T/C and a 2" lift, potentially fitting them on Land Rover freestyle alloys with spacers fitted...
Any thoughts, good, bad, just right?
My personal preference for a 33" tire on a Defender is a 255/85R16. Fits well with a stock set of springs, no rubbing, and just looks right. I run that size on my CT Defender 110 with Wolf Rims, no offset or spacers. If you wheel locally mud is your main foe. The skinny tire is superior in that condition. More so when the lower power of a diesel Defender is factored in.
Wider tires are nice for crawling and technical wheeling, but you really don't see a lot of that in Alberta. When tires are a factor, it's mostly point and gun-it wheeling here. 255/85R16 would be my recommendation.
We run 285/75 R16 rubber on both our D1 and D2 on the alloy rims with around a two inch lift. They work perfectly on the D2, even room for tire chains.The D1 needed minor fender trimming and rubs at full turn without wheel spacers. Wider tires are your friend for flotation, and you should have plenty of power- that's what low range is there for. Not as though high speed is needed on many trails. We didn't even regear the diffs. As for "point and shoot" that's what keeps TRS and SCC in business*lol*
Sent from my XP7700 using Tapatalk
If you're running mud, skinny is better. And its all about big power. Low gearing works against you. Mudders run as high a gearing as possible, and as high a HP as possble (1000HP at 3.43 gears is a nice balance). It's about getting those tires rotating, and slinging mud baby!
Floatation is a wives tale, wider = resistance in mud, that's all. Watch any hard core mudder and he'll be running tall and skinny to get down to terra firma, and cranking as much raw HP with as tall a gear possible through it. Point, pedal, pray!
Skinny doesn't help in technical rock crawling though, as you've got less tire on the ground and less footprint, and that often works against you. Big HP really isn't as much of an advantage either unless you're running buggies and doing tubs or leaping up fins, but there its more about low overall weight than it is raw HP. Stuff is much more grabby, so when you land on it with a bunch of pedal going, stuff tends to snap.
Sure. 285s work well.
Thanks guys, I guess either size 255/85 or 285/75 are around the same height 285 fills the arches a inch or so wider just comes down to preference/ overall use...
Now to start looking and comparing.... Well after I fix the latest oil leak first that is ::)
Cheers.
Trevor ,you are correct, huge power and massive wheelspin will get you through almost anything. But you need massive drivetrain to handle it. And all that power tends to cause overheating issues. And you have to trailer your vehicle to the trail (usually) and it uses awful amounts of fuel.and it's hard to go slowly when needed. Flotation is very much important, that's why a foremost Delta has tires 6 ft wide. And remember, if you're the guy at the front clawing huge ruts to get through each mud hole, you won't be too popular with the people at the back of the pack that have to get through that mess. Makes us look like a bunch of Jack asses to the environment people and gets trails closed too
Sent from my XP7700 using Tapatalk
Oh, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying WE want to do that. I agree, those big hp, big tired rigs are for the dedicated competition muds pits.
I was just trying to raise the question of "what's the rig used for" as the tires need to fit that role as best as possible. A little skinnier/taller is nice for mud. Or a bit wider perhaps if more technical stuff is in the future for the truck.
And of course just the general look of the tire on the truck is a factor...but that's a very personal, subjective thing of course.
I ran 285/75r16 on my 130 and 110 for years. They rub slightly on the rear spring hangers and on the front radius arms at full lock. If you can live with that they're fine. I just got new tires, 255/85r16 and both problems gone....a tiny bit taller tire but an inch skinnier. I vote for the 255's.
Mike
Quote from: s3landy on May 20, 2018, 07:44 AMThey rub slightly on the rear spring hangers and on the front radius arms at full lock.
You won't have the rear spring issue on a 90. The springs are smaller. The radius arm issue is solved by adjusting the steering stops. Bigger is always better, off road.
Couldn't adjust the stops out any more. It was like turning the QEII !
Mike
Quote from: s3landy on May 20, 2018, 08:32 AM
Couldn't adjust the stops out any more. It was like turning the QEII !
Whether or not it hits the stop or the radius arms, the turning circle is the same.
A 285/75R16 is a great choice for a Defender. You can't go too big on these trucks. They are heavy and need as much tire as possible.
It is the largest size that will fit without any trimming. You need the correct offset to prevent any rubbing and make best use of the available space. An offset around 10 mm is about perfect. Keep in mind that different tire brands are different real world sizes and LR build quality is plus or minus an inch, so you need to check on your own truck for clearance. The tire will usually hit the rear flares at full stuff, but I've not seen this cause any issues. Most people never notice. They will also touch the tub at the top if you can reach the bump stops. Again, this rarely causes issues as most people's springs are too stiff for this contact to be severe. I try and always check with the springs removed for tire clearance and shock travel.
That said, most people would benefit from 1" taller rear bump stops and 2" lower shock mounts (plus longer brake lines and spring retainers) as they are not using all of the compression travel available. This is true for 100% of spring lifts. A 2" spring lift leaves you with very little extension travel and the stiff springs limit real world compression travel. It is a real pet peeve of mine that companies sell "lift kits" without all of the proper parts.
"Whether or not it hits the stop or the radius arms, the turning circle is the same."
Turning radius is affected by how far the wheels turn. Bigger tires hit the radius arms first, thus not allowing them to hit the turning stops=bigger radius.
With the 10" 255's they allow the wheels to turn further to hit the stops instead of the radius arms=tighter turning radius.
I run 285/75R16 Goodyear Duratrac tyres, stock alloy "Cyclone" wheels and 30mm spacers on my 300tdi 110 right now. No lift. They work great.
They actually belong to my Rangie and my Defender is just "borrowing" them to try them on for size.
As for skinny v fat, I'm gonna stay out of that one...
My 2c.
The tires currently on the 88" are a set of 285/75R16 Duratrac's like Matt. I would have liked 255's as well but they aren't as common so options aren't as many. I've run 235's and 12.5" tires on this truck and will offer these unscientific observations:
1. Wider tires seem less stable on the road. They seemed to wander more.
2. Wider tires do offer more floatation.
Lot's of other factors influence the above. I prefer the 235's on road and the wider tires off road. In terms of floatation I would like to clarify that I'm not talking about being able to drive on top of mud/snow vs sinking in. It's the degree of penetration as much as the ability to traverse the ground. I used to believe that the only option was tall and skinny. For moderately deep snow/mud with a solid bottom that works great. There are other times where it's not ideal. An example is driving across a slightly soggy grassy meadow. Narrow tires with a smaller contact patch will dig in while wider tires at the extreme will hardly leave a mark.
I've been really happy with the balance of a 285 tire on the 88" and went so far as getting rid on my larger 'off road' set of tires and rims. Keep in mind that my limited wheeling experience has either been mostly in the foothills of the Rockies from muskeg to hard rock terrain. In comparison, for the absurdly heavy LR3 I wouldn't consider a narrow (235) tire, even if they did fit.
Cheers,
Kirk
And this is what happens when your tires are too small for the weight of your vehicle.... Everyone else drove up without issue. Another trail we are no longer allowed to drive on :'(
I was browsing through the pictures of that trip and found a photo of some proper flotation tires, with suitable chains. ;D ;D ;D ;D
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4537/38193642532_3ef0954a85_b.jpg)
Hehe, yup, that's where flotation applies all right. Tires being larger than the vehicle they are on does indeed tend to add floatation. Or the tundra buggies...3 lb of air in 60" tires :)
...here's how the pro's get through the mud...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEliDcDrpLI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEliDcDrpLI)
Tall, thin, and a ton of HP. ;->
Thanks for all the input guys,
So I have 235 bfg mud's was looking for a extra set of wider mud tires ...yes cheap!
So 285's including used wheels all mounted and balanced for under $900
That's a pretty good deal!
Not a bad price for a BFG at all, but those aren't BFG's.
I've not heard of that brand before. "Powerway M/T Wideway" or something to that effect from what I can read on the tire.
Lol, sorry Trevor not trying to confuse anyone
I have a set of 235's bfg tires..
This extra new set ( not fitted yet) are Powerway and in 285...as I want to try bigger tires
This is the 90 on 235's.......
ah, ok, that makes more sense then!
285's...... all fitted ;)
Your doing it all wrong!
As a Land Rover owner your garage is supposed to be so full of crap that you will never use or forgot you even have that it should be impossible to squeeze a car in there. Let alone enough space to stand back and take pictures. Have you no fear of dipleasing the Rover Gods?
What are you thinking man?
New tyres look good though. Fill the wheel arches nicely.
;D
That was all I saw as well. A huge, empty clean garage. Man, do I need that badly.
Quote from: Red90 on June 11, 2018, 01:58 PM
;D
That was all I saw as well. A huge, empty clean garage. Man, do I need that badly.
I'm still waiting for the echo to dye down ahahhahahhaha
I have good connections lol
It's a 3 bay satellite oilfield shop that I have full use of
Tons of room to work in ...beats my yes, half full of landrover stuff single car one at home.....
At work I have a 14000 square foot shop with 30 foot roof and 10 tonne overhead crane. Unfortunately it is 50 km from my house.
Quote from: Matt H on June 11, 2018, 12:37 PM
As a Land Rover owner your garage is supposed to be so full of crap that you will never use or forgot you even have that it should be impossible to squeeze a car in there. Let alone enough space to stand back and take pictures. Have you no fear of dipleasing the Rover Gods?
You have described my shop exactly. I keep reminding myself as long as I have projects to finish, I have a reason to keep living. Without adding to the list I think I am good till 90.
The end of August we are going to New Zealand to celebrate my Mother-in law's 100th birthday. Too bad I didn't inherit some of her genes then I could add to my list of projects to do.