Alberta Land Rover Enthusiasts Club Forum
General => Technical Discussions => Topic started by: B-Red on March 31, 2018, 02:12 PM
I was wondering if anybody has experience with bead lock rims. I saw a you tube video for 35" tires on a Disco 2. They seem to be adaptable to road side repairs on the trail. Can they be applied for 32" tires as well?
Emad
Sure. The most common types have balance problems though as there is nothing centering the outer bead. The ones that I have do center the bead but they do not make a Disco 2 version.
I'm not sure they would be much use though. The main point is to run really low pressures. With such a short side wall you can't run pressures very low.
For trail repairs, carry a plugging kit.
Red 90, must disagree about the sidewall/ pressure relationship. I'd assume anyone running beadlocks on a D2 would use 16" rims. This would give plenty of sidewall on 32" tires for flex. I occasionally ran 10 psi in 245/75 R16 (31.5") on 16" non-beadlocks with no problems. Lack of onboard air made this only practical on trails close to home so I could drive back at low pressure and air up.
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The balance issue is entirely valid though!
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I ran my cyurrent 32" on 15 psi with stock 16" rims without a problem. I was interested if they would be easier to operate on a high puncture trail. We did over 23 tire repairs on the AMT three years ago. The traditional method to fix these tires were labour intensive. These appeared to be simpler. I am concerned however about the balancing aspect. It seems to be a concern.
I suppose. 10 psi would have them running really flat on a D2. They are heavy and Emad's truck is not on the light end of the D2 scale.
Let's consider the math. Emad's truck is 1500 pounds at least on a wheel. Probably 265s. Say a 8.5" wide tread. Gives a 17.6" long contact patch. 2.7" deflection. Around 35% deflection which is more than most people would go.
Quote from: B-Red on March 31, 2018, 04:43 PM
The traditional method to fix these tires were labour intensive. These appeared to be simpler. I am concerned however about the balancing aspect. It seems to be a concern.
What were you guys doing? You should have just been plugging them. It takes minutes. You can even leave the wheel on the truck.
If you were taking the tires off of the rims, that was a waste of time for trail repairs. As to the time removing tires from the rims, a beadlocks would take as long as tire irons. It is a lot of bolts.
I don't recall that many tire plugs. I plugged a couple tires for different trucks...one on Bills truck and one on Jeffrey's. Those were both sidewall plugs and quite a bit more involved, and off course they were off the vehicles at that time.
Regarding rims, I wouldn't recommend beadlocks for something like the AMT. You aren't going to run at really low air pressure anyway due to the fact you will be loaded with supplies. That's all a beadlock buys you really, it prevents the tire from slipping on the rim at very low air pressure.
For harder core wheeling I don't run my 33" tires any lower than 14 --> 15lbs. The problems with the D2's is that they are heavy enough that when you get the vehicle standing on one or 2 tires, you will be on the rim for sure below those pressures. So you're kicking the crap out of the tire, and it is also really prone to pull itself off at that point.
If you want to do something with you rims I would recommend getting a set of the stock steel rims like what came on my G4. They hold a bead INCREDIBLY well and are very strong as well.
The other strategy to make flat repair easier is to run tougher tires. We run bfg km2 s and Cooper discoverer mt s. Have never had a flat on the trail, even on nasty rocks at cadomin.
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Quote from: pechanec on April 01, 2018, 05:02 PM
The other strategy to make flat repair easier is to run tougher tires. We run bfg km2 s and Cooper discoverer mt s. Have never had a flat on the trail, even on nasty rocks at cadomin.
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Good point. Tire makes a big difference. I've settled on the BFG KM2's as well. Great tire, very tough!
I'm phasing out the Cooper's and running all KM2 s
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The trouble I ran into on AMT was the tube tires. Running low pressure caused lots of friction and hence leaks.
I am looking at the BFG KM2 for the Disco this summer.
I am however, looking at the method that John and Trevor were analyzing the tire pressure va weight vs articulation. Is there a formula out there that am missing?
Primerly, when we change the tire size from Stovk; how do you determine the proper inflation required on the new size?
A rough guide is to use chalk method to work out a highway pressure.
If you still want Beadlocks without the extra weight and hassles of a traditional ring style you may want to check out the Staun or Coyote internal Beadlocks.
Not sure about the D2 stock wheels but the older post 92 alloy Land Rover wheels have a massive safety bead land cast into the wheels. I regularly run 10psi rear and 12psi in front with 33" tyres on stock Range Rover wheels and have never spun a tyre or peeled it off the rim...yet.
Steep hills, hard turns, lockers and side hills really kicks the heck out of most tyres at low psi though. Easy to bruse or get a pinch flat if you run super low pressure on a hard trail with a radial tyre, especially a AT. Lots of folks prefer a bias ply for that reason. Also, if you air down too much you start to loose valuable diff clearance. Something you can't afford to waste with a smaller tyre.
Tubes? When will you guys learn your lesson? Do you know how many beers I missed because Bill ran tubes on that trail!!!
Toyo Open Country M/T. They are the toughest radials.
As to determining a safe air down. Measure the side wall height at road pressure. Drop 20% of this height. 25% at most. Do this test at home in the garage. It will be different numbers front and rear. This is to allow you to double the load in articulation and steep climbs.
When you get below 10 psi, popping beads becomes a lot easier. Spinning the tire is usually not a problem with tubeless tires. This is why tubes are a pain in the ass off road.
Quote from: Red90 on April 02, 2018, 07:55 PM
Tubes? When will you guys learn your lesson? Do you know how many beers I missed because Bill ran tubes on that trail!!!
Toyo Open Country M/T. They are the toughest radials.
I know several guys that run the Toyo's, and swear by them. Excellent tire.
hehe, and tubes are not allowed on the AMT this time!
Edit: One other thing worth mentioning if you are shopping for tires, don't ignore the weight of the tire especially if you aren't running upgraded axles. The pretzel sticks that are LR stock axles will not like big heavy tires. Now, "big and heavy" also usually comes with "tougher". That's why I do like the KM2's as a nice compromise. They are a nice balance of toughness and weight. Toyo's, Maxxis, etc are very tough, but they are heavier...
285/75R16's:
KM2 -- 60lbs
Toyo OCMT-- 67lbs
315/75R16's:
KM2 -- 67lbs
Toyo OCMT -- 81lbs
Maxxis Creepy Crawler (35x12.5-16) -- 78lbs
These are of course 33" and 35" tires, which are what I am looking at. As the sizes get smaller, the weight differential narrows. But as one can see, the Toyo's are a pretty heavy tire. I'm running 300m axles so it wouldn't be as big a concern, but if I were running stock I'd be hesitant to run them in place of the KM2's. But then again, if I were running stock axles I wouldn't be running 33" or 35" tires either. :)
Yes, tubes are mostly good for floating down the river in hot summer afternoons. Not for tires😉
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Tubes work okay...just DON'T air them down below 25psi or the tire tends to spin on the rim, tearing the tubes.
Bead lockers.....I've heard they are not legal on the roads.....is that true?
I came across this article when I was trying to figure out the chalk method that Matt mentioned.
https://www.4wheelparts.com/tire-wheel-package-guide/tire-pressure-checker.aspx
The discussion here is very informative. I am coming to the realization ghat my tire blowout outside Sylvan lake may have been the result of the tire being inflated to 40 psi instead of going lower.
I am looking at new tires this year so I will be reviewing this information very closely. I learned a new thing today for sure. Thank you fellows. Cheers
Binch, I have read the same thing about beadlocks. Luckily, we live in Alberta where we can do almost anything we want to our vehicles without official hassle! 😀
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